Return terminal with gondola cabins on line for summer operations.This lift replaced an older Doppelmayr high speed quad.Bottom terminal in winter.Looking down from tower 8.View up the line.Lift line view.Top terminal with maintenance rails.The drive terminal is longer than most Uni-GS terminals that were built.Gondola cabins parked for the winter.View down line.Lower lift line.Lower station and depression tower 1.Breakover towers.Loading area.Doppelmayr CTEC tower.
They could have been used on the old Glacier Chaser Express as well, which is from 1989, and these cabins are from that era. Obviously they must have been refitted with new Agamatic-104 grips (replacing the old DS-104 grips), and possibly new hanger arms as well.
If you look at he pics of Swift Creek Express (Former Glacier Chaser Express), you’ll notice it has rather elongated hanger arms, so I’d imagine that it was designed with Gondola Cabins in mind. On the UNI-GS models, the hangers are far longer without design modification like early UNI models (GCX & it’s longer arms). So with the new Big Mountain Express, it was the cabins that had new hangers designed instead of the chairs being modded, the bowden cable rail is actually hidden inside the terminal (much like modern LPA lifts from competitor LPOA). And as a side note, having ridden this lift in summer and winter, in the summer, a large portion of the chairs are removed with massive spacing and the gondola cabins are added with every chair/cabin stopping completely thanks to the spacing system. Over all it’s a very unique lift despite looking like a standard merger era UNI-GS, I expect it to be around for at least another 10-15 years.
I wonder if it would be possible to modify the terminals so that the cabins could be used year round and it be a chondola. The issue would be terminal speed as it’s always faster on chairs than gondolas. In the summer they just run slower so it wouldn’t be an issue there.
In theory, in order to slow down one side of the terminal to permit gondola loading, you would really just have to change 2 belts in the entire contour, and the diameter of the end wheel they are spinning. However, the cabins are not level-walk-ins, and in order to make a gondola that one can actually load, they would have to pour concrete for an entire loading platform. It might cost more than its worth (in terms of the on-mountain experience) to convert to a Chondola, but it’s a cool and very possible idea nonetheless.
On a similar note, this may the only Uni-GS that runs with cabins at some point during the course of the year. I can’t think of any others off the top of my head.
The GS terminals were sold only in North America if I recall correctly. During that time, Doppelmayr definitely built gondolas but they used the G terminals (or equipment housed in a custom building).
That’s really interesting. I’d guess the only thing you can’t reach w/o a hike is the top half of Flower Point and Big Foot? That’s got to be close to 500 acres altogether, but even serving 2500 acres with one lift is impressive. Wonder what the North American Top 10 would look like on that.
Jackson Tram gets you what – 1500-2000?
Great Escape at Schweitzer looks like it’s over 2000 but not 2500
Technically, maybe High Noon at Vail beats all of them when including Sun Up, Sun Down, bottom of Tea Cup, most of Game Creek and then everything on the front side except Highline.
I could be way off here, but assuming reported acreage is accurate (and it isn’t), I would guess there are a lot of lifts in the 1500-2000 acre range. The summit chairs from many of the mid-large ski areas have huge amounts of terrain available. I’m thinking about Stoke at Revelstoke, Panorama at Mammoth, Mineral and Tram at Snowbird, Summit at Alpine, and all 3 summit lifts at Discovery. Then there’s Whistler-Blackcomb… they could have half the top 10 alone. If were talking just within their own pods, the list gets a lot different.
The only one immediately coming to mind that competes with the BMX is Summit at Panorama, but I’m sure I’m missing lifts.
Yeah – some good points there. Definitely depends on definitions.
Within those you named, and assuming we are talking solely about lifts out of a “base area” of some kind (to avoid Summit lifts that technically could access all terrain at a given resort), I think Panorama gondola at Mammoth might rise to the top. That gives you access to every inch of Mammoth’s 3,500 acres with the exception of a few hundred acres on the top half of Ch 22 and 25 respectively. It’s almost surely >3000 acres, which I *think* makes it #1 in North America by the definition of “base area” lift.
Interesting indeed! Add the gondola at Crystal to the list, although somewhere around #10-15. I’d guess around 1700, 1800 acres. Crystal claims 2600 acres in total, although in comparison to, say, Bogus, who also claim 2600, Crystal seems bigger, so it’s all conjecture. Anyway, the gondola gets you all of the front side (the knob of Upper E is technically hike-to, but what’s 10 or 12 herringbones among friends) except a 3 minute walk to the Elk Chutes, all of North (Short, Long, and Far) except a couple chutes of the top of Northway Peak, all of Bear Pits, and even some of 9 if you’re ambitious. If one is even more creative, there’s always the Park. If I understood goooooogle earth, I might be able to figure actual acreage.
Nope- it’s an upper-mountain lift. Doug was referring only to out-of-base lifts, and last I checked you need to ride two to get up to chair 9.
At Copper, if you ride the Flyer you can access the bulk of the west side, at 1240 acres; if you decide on the Bee, you can get to almost all of the east side including the lower half of Spaulding Bowl, at 1370 acres. Nothing like Pano at Mammoth, but respectable.
While we’re at it…What lift offers the most lappable/repeatable terrain?
Panorama at Mammoth would still do well, but it would be beat by the trams at Snowbird and JH. The old chairs 1 and 6 at Schweitzer would have been surprisingly close, but both were split into 2 lifts when they were replaced. Crystal’s gondola, the Blackomb & Whistler Gondolas, and Kicking Horse would all be in contention.
A tier down you’d have the gondola at Ski Apache, the longgg HSQ’s at Angel Fire, Crested Butte, Fernie, Kimberly, the Aspen Gondola, Palisade’s tram, and Motherlode at Red.
Lift Blog 
Its technically a chondola in the summer but a normal high speed quad in the winter!
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Any idea where the cabins came from? They clearly weren’t new since the lift was built in 2007 and CWA discontinued that cabin design in 1997.
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They could have been used on the old Glacier Chaser Express as well, which is from 1989, and these cabins are from that era. Obviously they must have been refitted with new Agamatic-104 grips (replacing the old DS-104 grips), and possibly new hanger arms as well.
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If you look at he pics of Swift Creek Express (Former Glacier Chaser Express), you’ll notice it has rather elongated hanger arms, so I’d imagine that it was designed with Gondola Cabins in mind. On the UNI-GS models, the hangers are far longer without design modification like early UNI models (GCX & it’s longer arms). So with the new Big Mountain Express, it was the cabins that had new hangers designed instead of the chairs being modded, the bowden cable rail is actually hidden inside the terminal (much like modern LPA lifts from competitor LPOA). And as a side note, having ridden this lift in summer and winter, in the summer, a large portion of the chairs are removed with massive spacing and the gondola cabins are added with every chair/cabin stopping completely thanks to the spacing system. Over all it’s a very unique lift despite looking like a standard merger era UNI-GS, I expect it to be around for at least another 10-15 years.
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For reference:
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I wonder if it would be possible to modify the terminals so that the cabins could be used year round and it be a chondola. The issue would be terminal speed as it’s always faster on chairs than gondolas. In the summer they just run slower so it wouldn’t be an issue there.
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In theory, in order to slow down one side of the terminal to permit gondola loading, you would really just have to change 2 belts in the entire contour, and the diameter of the end wheel they are spinning. However, the cabins are not level-walk-ins, and in order to make a gondola that one can actually load, they would have to pour concrete for an entire loading platform. It might cost more than its worth (in terms of the on-mountain experience) to convert to a Chondola, but it’s a cool and very possible idea nonetheless.
On a similar note, this may the only Uni-GS that runs with cabins at some point during the course of the year. I can’t think of any others off the top of my head.
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So there are no UNI-GS gondolas? Did Doppelmayr build no gondolas during the GS period? (Other than UNI-G lifts shipped across the pond)
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There is one in Texas.
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What cabins are those? Their geometry doesn’t resemble anything I’ve seen.
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They are the CWA Ethos. Also found on one of Tremblant’s gondolas.
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The GS terminals were sold only in North America if I recall correctly. During that time, Doppelmayr definitely built gondolas but they used the G terminals (or equipment housed in a custom building).
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This lift serves vrtiually all of WMR’s 3,000 acres. Probably among the largest terrain served by a single lift
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That’s really interesting. I’d guess the only thing you can’t reach w/o a hike is the top half of Flower Point and Big Foot? That’s got to be close to 500 acres altogether, but even serving 2500 acres with one lift is impressive. Wonder what the North American Top 10 would look like on that.
Jackson Tram gets you what – 1500-2000?
Great Escape at Schweitzer looks like it’s over 2000 but not 2500
Technically, maybe High Noon at Vail beats all of them when including Sun Up, Sun Down, bottom of Tea Cup, most of Game Creek and then everything on the front side except Highline.
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I could be way off here, but assuming reported acreage is accurate (and it isn’t), I would guess there are a lot of lifts in the 1500-2000 acre range. The summit chairs from many of the mid-large ski areas have huge amounts of terrain available. I’m thinking about Stoke at Revelstoke, Panorama at Mammoth, Mineral and Tram at Snowbird, Summit at Alpine, and all 3 summit lifts at Discovery. Then there’s Whistler-Blackcomb… they could have half the top 10 alone. If were talking just within their own pods, the list gets a lot different.
The only one immediately coming to mind that competes with the BMX is Summit at Panorama, but I’m sure I’m missing lifts.
Consider my curiosity piqued though.
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Yeah – some good points there. Definitely depends on definitions.
Within those you named, and assuming we are talking solely about lifts out of a “base area” of some kind (to avoid Summit lifts that technically could access all terrain at a given resort), I think Panorama gondola at Mammoth might rise to the top. That gives you access to every inch of Mammoth’s 3,500 acres with the exception of a few hundred acres on the top half of Ch 22 and 25 respectively. It’s almost surely >3000 acres, which I *think* makes it #1 in North America by the definition of “base area” lift.
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The new Wild Blue gondola at steamboat that will be built in 2022 should give you access to more than 2000 acres.
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WMR claims Flower Point to be 200 acres: https://www.snow-country.com/news/entry/flower-point-project-at-whitefish-means-new-triple-chair-for-intermediate-terrain
Big Foot would be way smaller, maybe 50 acres.
I was thinking to only include out of base area lifts. Panorama at Mammoth would beat BMX. Snowbird’s tram would come close
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Interesting indeed! Add the gondola at Crystal to the list, although somewhere around #10-15. I’d guess around 1700, 1800 acres. Crystal claims 2600 acres in total, although in comparison to, say, Bogus, who also claim 2600, Crystal seems bigger, so it’s all conjecture. Anyway, the gondola gets you all of the front side (the knob of Upper E is technically hike-to, but what’s 10 or 12 herringbones among friends) except a 3 minute walk to the Elk Chutes, all of North (Short, Long, and Far) except a couple chutes of the top of Northway Peak, all of Bear Pits, and even some of 9 if you’re ambitious. If one is even more creative, there’s always the Park. If I understood goooooogle earth, I might be able to figure actual acreage.
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I think the Imperial Express SuperChair would be on that list.
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Nope- it’s an upper-mountain lift. Doug was referring only to out-of-base lifts, and last I checked you need to ride two to get up to chair 9.
At Copper, if you ride the Flyer you can access the bulk of the west side, at 1240 acres; if you decide on the Bee, you can get to almost all of the east side including the lower half of Spaulding Bowl, at 1370 acres. Nothing like Pano at Mammoth, but respectable.
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While we’re at it…What lift offers the most lappable/repeatable terrain?
Panorama at Mammoth would still do well, but it would be beat by the trams at Snowbird and JH. The old chairs 1 and 6 at Schweitzer would have been surprisingly close, but both were split into 2 lifts when they were replaced. Crystal’s gondola, the Blackomb & Whistler Gondolas, and Kicking Horse would all be in contention.
A tier down you’d have the gondola at Ski Apache, the longgg HSQ’s at Angel Fire, Crested Butte, Fernie, Kimberly, the Aspen Gondola, Palisade’s tram, and Motherlode at Red.
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I agree RyanD, the real question is how much acreage a lift serves that you can ski back to the lift from.
Using google earth, here are some fun approximations:
Snowbird Tram- ~1k acres
Alta Collins- ~400-600 acres (depending on if you count Backside)
Jackson Tram- ~1.5k acres
Squaw KT-22- ~400 acres
Squaw Tram (including Broken Arrow)- ~350 acres
Alpine Meadows Summit (no hiking)- ~350 acres
Alpine Meadows Summit (all frontside runs)- ~700 acres
Mammoth Panorama (full)- ~800 acres
Mammoth Panorama (upper)- ~350 acres
Mammoth Chair 9- ~350 acres
Aspen Gondola- ~800 acres (more than advertised??)
Highlands Temerity (no hiking)- ~300 acres
Highlands Temerity (with all of bowl)- ~500 acres
Snowmass Sheer Bliss- ~600 acres
Vail Chair 5- ~600 acres
Vail chair 21 (without Mongolia)- ~1k acres
Vail Chair 21 (with Mongolia)- ~1.3k acres
Winter Park Panoramic- ~500 acres
Crested Butte Silver Queen- ~450 acres
Targhee Peaked and Dreamcather- both ~500 acres
Mt Bachelor Northwest- ~1k acres
Mt Bachelor Cloudchaser- ~500 acres
Mt Bachelor Summit- ~400 acres
Crystal Gondola- ~700 acres
Kicking Horse Gondola (no hiking)- ~850 acres
Kicking Horse Gondola (hiking to Super Bowl and T1/T2)- ~1050 acres
Revelstoke Stoke- ~750 acres
Red Mountain Motherlode- ~1k acres
Red Mountain Grey- ~500 acres
Whistler Symphony (with flute bowl)- ~600 acres
Whistler Symphony (no flute bowl)- ~400 acres
Schweitzer Great Escape- ~400 acres
Whitefish Big Mountain- ~800 acres
Fernie Timber Bowl- ~500 acres
Kimberley Northstar Express- ~650 acres
Whistler Gondola- ~1.2k acres
Whistler Gondola (Upper)- ~1.1k acres
Blackcomb Gondola- ~800 acres
Blackcomb Gondola Upper- ~400 acres
Angel Fire Chile Express- ~500 acres
Alyeska Tram- ~400 acres
Killington K1 Gondola- ~450 acres
Killington Skyeship- ~400 acres
Killington Skyeship before Lower Juggernaut trail was closed- ~800 acres
Original Killington Gondola in original configuration- ~1.2k acres
Stowe Forerunner- ~400 acres
Mad River Single- ~300 acres
Wildcat Express- ~500 acres
Sugarloaf Superquad- ~500 acres
Jay Tram- ~500 acres
Tremblant Duncan- ~600 acres
International edition (for fun):
Chamonix Aiguille Du Midi (just Vallee Blanche)- ~2000 acres
Zermatt Hohtali tram- ~1.5k acres
La Grave Gondola (no/minimal hiking)- ~1.6k acres
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Original Glacier Chaser Express:
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