Lower terminal seen from the Black Mountain Express.View up the line from the base area.Yan drive-tension station.Counterweight for tension.Loading area.Half towers followed by half towers.Upper part of the lift line.Tower 13.The breakover.Fixed top bullwheel.Looking down the line.Lift overview.
Access to Beavers, which is somewhat more mellow terrain, and might attract younger or less experienced riders. To be fair, Lenawee has greater access, but bars might still be important.
When they replace the lift, they will add safety bars. The new lift will be a double, but personal, I think they should do a triple chair as it is near the Beavers Lift.
Pallavicini is the one remaining lift at A-Basin to not have bars on it. All the other lifts have bars, and Pallavicini is the most direct way of getting to the Beavers, a lift that has bars.
I’ve wondered this for years.Randy (comment below) has the only explanation I’ve found reasonable. As a longtime lift mechanic, I’ve said for years they aren’t ‘safety’ bars, since they won’t keep a person locked in the chair.
Bars help us with fear of heights. Arapahoe has chairs that cross some serious high points I’d never be able to ride without the bar. Zuma has a 3 tier tower on it’s line that runs along the top of the trees. Lenawee crosses over dercum gulch run that has to be a good 1000 feet over the run (OK not really but seriously is high). I’m sure others with height issues would have panic attacks. One reason I haven’t ridden the Pali chair since my teen years when heights didn’t bother me.
Agree chairs are no safer with restraining bars in fact they may less safe with kids in some cases. Many kids fall out from improper use of restraining bars.
But—- The perception is that there safer and many riders want them. Restraining bars are pretty much a must have on ski school lifts.
So restraining bars are here to stay and will continue to be installed on existing lifts.
Not sure who your addressing in your Rant about several posts from a month ago. Maybe you should first seek counseling at about your phobia of people from Denver, who ever they might be. And then make sure you put the bar down, would hate to see you fall out.
My original query was about the obsession on this here blog thing with comfort bars, not their actual day-to-day usage. I do not think people who use them are somehow unworthy of the mountains or skiing or anything else. I do not understand bars that do not have footrests, but my only real complaint is when someone smacks me on the helmet with one without first asking if it’s okay to lower it. If someone asks, my answer is always “yes”, with zero deliberation. I understand that they help some folks out, especially those with height issues or those who grew up in places where the use was required by law or enforced by culture. Here, in large portions of the west, they either do not exist or are left up unless there are kids or ski school, or for the relief a footrest can bring a sore knee/back/ankle. When I use the footrest on near-as-makes-no-difference mile-long Northway chair, up at Crystal, am I a meathead poser? There’s no shortage of serious, dangerous terrain I need to ski to get to the chair, and I’ve been skiing it since I was 6 or 7 when there was only a dirty-floored bus for egress. Also, I’ve never lived in Denver, and only spent one odd evening there in ‘004 playing a show at a funky bar. To where should I go home and stay? I guess, even with 40 winters of skiing aggressively and with at least a modicum of technical prowess, I really am a kook. I even live with the cognitive dissonance of both using and not using the footrest. Dang. It’s a hard life.
I can rip pretty much anything at A-Basin….standing on top the Upper East Wall staring into the notches doesn’t overly scare me, but for whatever reason I have developed a fear of heights as I have gotten a bit older. Lifts with high spans scare me a bit and yes the bar helps. I can’t go up on ladders anymore above about 12 feet off the ground. Nothing to do with good, or lack thereof my skiing skills are.
I was at A-Basin in mid-April and there were some days the winds were just ripping over the ridgeline. Pali was still open, but even people who didn’t lower the bar at first, were lowering them on the upper half of the lift as the chair were swinging in the gusts.
I had the pleasure of riding the Lenawee triple a few weeks back with Al Henceroth, A-Basin’s COO and writer of the excellent Al’s Blog. The very first thing he did as we left the terminal was: ask to put the bar down.
Many of the newest lifts feature updated bar designs, with plastic or steel extensions that go between the legs and reach the seat. These seem particularly well suited to keep younger kids safe. In fact, the new Pali has these installed.
I always put the bar down. In the Northeast, from my experience, most people do. I didn’t even realize it was somehow controversial until I started skiing out west. Putting the bar down doesn’t make you any less of an experienced skier. If anything it signifies you grew up somewhere where people actually learn how to carve properly.
I understand that it’s a special lift, but oh my god. Imagine when KT-22 gets replaced and those chairs go on sale. Not sure how much a chair actually costs to buy from a manufacturer but these legendary lifts might make back a lot of money from these shenanigans.
Safety bars are really comfortable. I don’t know why you wouldn’t want to ride one without it. Even the ones without foot rests allow you to rest your hands. Also I definitely agree that it helps people afraid of heights!!! Also it’s an intelligent business move as if someone falls of them the resort could be sued.
Discussing safety bars and the use / non use of them is a bit like talking Republican vs Democrat or Trump vs Biden for president. As a Canadian living in Ontario, I grew up skiiing ski hills where use of the “pull down” bar was required. Personally i am afraid to be on a lift without using the bar. However i do understand that people decide for themselves that they do not want to use the bar, then make up reasons in their own head why they should not be required to use that bar help restrain them and other chair passengers. Opened a real hornets nest of opinions on this one. :)
Lift Blog 
I wonder if Pali will get bars since it now serves as access to Beavers, or if it’ll be gone too soon to matter.
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What does it needs bars for?
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Access to Beavers, which is somewhat more mellow terrain, and might attract younger or less experienced riders. To be fair, Lenawee has greater access, but bars might still be important.
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When they replace the lift, they will add safety bars. The new lift will be a double, but personal, I think they should do a triple chair as it is near the Beavers Lift.
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Why is everyone on here so obsessed with safety bars?
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Pallavicini is the one remaining lift at A-Basin to not have bars on it. All the other lifts have bars, and Pallavicini is the most direct way of getting to the Beavers, a lift that has bars.
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I’ve wondered this for years.Randy (comment below) has the only explanation I’ve found reasonable. As a longtime lift mechanic, I’ve said for years they aren’t ‘safety’ bars, since they won’t keep a person locked in the chair.
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Bars help us with fear of heights. Arapahoe has chairs that cross some serious high points I’d never be able to ride without the bar. Zuma has a 3 tier tower on it’s line that runs along the top of the trees. Lenawee crosses over dercum gulch run that has to be a good 1000 feet over the run (OK not really but seriously is high). I’m sure others with height issues would have panic attacks. One reason I haven’t ridden the Pali chair since my teen years when heights didn’t bother me.
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They’re replacing this lift this summer!
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Posted on Al’s Blog (COO) today regarding the retirement and replacement of the Pali chair in Summer 2020:
http://arapahoebasin.blogspot.com/2020/02/retiring-pallavicini-lift.html
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A-Basin will effectively become an all-Poma mountain.
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‘Safety’ bars are stupid and not needed.
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I saw someone fall off of a chairlift, its better to have them than to not have them.
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People fall of chairs with safety bars on.
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Agree chairs are no safer with restraining bars in fact they may less safe with kids in some cases. Many kids fall out from improper use of restraining bars.
But—- The perception is that there safer and many riders want them. Restraining bars are pretty much a must have on ski school lifts.
So restraining bars are here to stay and will continue to be installed on existing lifts.
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You’re a total poser. For real, a total poser.
If you don’t want the bar don’t use it.
They’re for people that want them. Like beginners and little kids.
Not meathead posers like yourself.
Go back to Denver and stay there, kook.
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‘If you don’t want the bar don’t use it. They’re for people that want them. Like beginners and little kids.’
That was all you had to say. Let’s keep it civil, mate.
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Not sure who your addressing in your Rant about several posts from a month ago. Maybe you should first seek counseling at about your phobia of people from Denver, who ever they might be. And then make sure you put the bar down, would hate to see you fall out.
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My original query was about the obsession on this here blog thing with comfort bars, not their actual day-to-day usage. I do not think people who use them are somehow unworthy of the mountains or skiing or anything else. I do not understand bars that do not have footrests, but my only real complaint is when someone smacks me on the helmet with one without first asking if it’s okay to lower it. If someone asks, my answer is always “yes”, with zero deliberation. I understand that they help some folks out, especially those with height issues or those who grew up in places where the use was required by law or enforced by culture. Here, in large portions of the west, they either do not exist or are left up unless there are kids or ski school, or for the relief a footrest can bring a sore knee/back/ankle. When I use the footrest on near-as-makes-no-difference mile-long Northway chair, up at Crystal, am I a meathead poser? There’s no shortage of serious, dangerous terrain I need to ski to get to the chair, and I’ve been skiing it since I was 6 or 7 when there was only a dirty-floored bus for egress. Also, I’ve never lived in Denver, and only spent one odd evening there in ‘004 playing a show at a funky bar. To where should I go home and stay? I guess, even with 40 winters of skiing aggressively and with at least a modicum of technical prowess, I really am a kook. I even live with the cognitive dissonance of both using and not using the footrest. Dang. It’s a hard life.
LikeLiked by 1 person
A few things here:
I can rip pretty much anything at A-Basin….standing on top the Upper East Wall staring into the notches doesn’t overly scare me, but for whatever reason I have developed a fear of heights as I have gotten a bit older. Lifts with high spans scare me a bit and yes the bar helps. I can’t go up on ladders anymore above about 12 feet off the ground. Nothing to do with good, or lack thereof my skiing skills are.
I was at A-Basin in mid-April and there were some days the winds were just ripping over the ridgeline. Pali was still open, but even people who didn’t lower the bar at first, were lowering them on the upper half of the lift as the chair were swinging in the gusts.
LikeLiked by 1 person
I had the pleasure of riding the Lenawee triple a few weeks back with Al Henceroth, A-Basin’s COO and writer of the excellent Al’s Blog. The very first thing he did as we left the terminal was: ask to put the bar down.
Many of the newest lifts feature updated bar designs, with plastic or steel extensions that go between the legs and reach the seat. These seem particularly well suited to keep younger kids safe. In fact, the new Pali has these installed.
I always put the bar down. In the Northeast, from my experience, most people do. I didn’t even realize it was somehow controversial until I started skiing out west. Putting the bar down doesn’t make you any less of an experienced skier. If anything it signifies you grew up somewhere where people actually learn how to carve properly.
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The bidding for the chairs on this lift is currently at $5100 per chair… https://www.ebid.net/us/for-sale/pali-chair-arapahoe-basin-pallavicini-chair-192709696.htm
I understand that it’s a special lift, but oh my god. Imagine when KT-22 gets replaced and those chairs go on sale. Not sure how much a chair actually costs to buy from a manufacturer but these legendary lifts might make back a lot of money from these shenanigans.
LikeLike
Safety bars are really comfortable. I don’t know why you wouldn’t want to ride one without it. Even the ones without foot rests allow you to rest your hands. Also I definitely agree that it helps people afraid of heights!!! Also it’s an intelligent business move as if someone falls of them the resort could be sued.
LikeLike
Discussing safety bars and the use / non use of them is a bit like talking Republican vs Democrat or Trump vs Biden for president. As a Canadian living in Ontario, I grew up skiiing ski hills where use of the “pull down” bar was required. Personally i am afraid to be on a lift without using the bar. However i do understand that people decide for themselves that they do not want to use the bar, then make up reasons in their own head why they should not be required to use that bar help restrain them and other chair passengers. Opened a real hornets nest of opinions on this one. :)
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One of my favourite activities as a liftie in the summer was to ride upside down with my head off the front of the seat to freak out the tourists.
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I think you hit on something there: “should not be required”.
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RIP
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