Yan bottom station.Height-adjustable station with depression sheaves.Split tower 1.Lift line.Yan triple chairs.Another view of the drive station.Riding up the very long line.Middle section of the lift.Nearing the tree line.View back down.Unique top terminal setup.Yan hubcap sheaves and top bullwheel.One tower is painted white.View down the line.Middle lift line.Three offset towers in a row!
The sheaves on this lift seem very similar to the Quicksilver lift at Boreal. I wonder why the state of California allows this lift to run and not Quicksilver.
I was also curious as to find out what mechanical issues stopped Quicksilver from running. It was apparently due to aluminum sheaves and grip type. The majority of towers on Chair 10 seem to have been upgraded with Doppelmayr line gear with the exception of the white tower, depression sheaves and breakover. When I was at Kirkwood in 2010 for a powder day they only allowed Chair 10 to be loaded as a double. Our guide said it was due to the brushes on the motor needing replacement, as the motor wasn’t strong enough to pull a full line of chairs anymore. I think the motor has been replaced since then but not positive.
Side Note: I’ve heard the tower is painted white to prevent the metal from expanding too much from the heat of the sun. Which makes sense because its such a tall tower. But I’ve never seen this idea implemented in any other installation.
A bunch of Park City’s towers were also painted different colors for a number of years. Off the top of my head Crescent Express comes to mind, all the lower elevation towers were painted black (like most of the mountain), and the higher elevation towers were painted white. It’s either the same idea (preventing expansion from the sun’s heat) or somebody ran out of paint.
The Martis Camp Express at Northstar California runs north-south and its towers are split right down the middle. The north facing halves are black, the south facing parts white.
Some newer Doppelmayr detachables (like the lovely “Kanc8 the great” [https://liftblog.com/kancamagus-8-loon-mountain-nh/]) have reflectors on the top tower for the same purpose.
Thermal expansion of a 50′ pole would be less than 3/8″ even if the temperature difference was 100F. No doubt the towers could vary by feet without impacting anything with the compliance built into a cable system. Must be they ran out of paint and left it with primer or some other explanation.
Coefficient of thermal expansion of steel 0.00000645in/in/deg F to 0.00000720in/in/deg F; 50′ pole with 20F higher temperature would be 1/16″ higher.
It’s not that the tower gets taller, it’s that towers with heavy sun on one side but not the other can have one side expand more than the other, bringing the tower out of alignment.
It was Boreal’s decision to not run Quicksilver. There were issues with the Yan-10, they had that worked out with the state. The S-4 aluminum sheaves are in service a couple of areas in CA today.
The terrain on the wall is very steep with no groomer down. A detachable may encourage too many people who have no business on terrain like that. I suspect that is a large reason it has never been updated. Along with the fact that money would be better spent on a detachable on other parts of the mountain such as chair 4.
I agree, keep chair 10 a triple, just like chair 23 at Mammoth. A high speed quad does attract the wrong crowed. Chair 6 already has too many downloads because people can’t read a map.
It’s always amusing to watch “the wrong crowd” coming down from Chairs 6 and 10 right after lunch—and a few beers. “I’m gonna ski that thing, dang it!” Garage Sale City.
WHY WHITE? Posting this on a Kirkwood FB group, a group member “JK” responded with the ‘real story’ — a more probable explanation than anything mechanical or thermal considerations. JK recalled a discussion with a lift maintenance person on this topic which seems to be consistent and make sense. Paint doesn’t change much in the delta T, there are a huge range of loading, convection, and radiant conditions that are far more significant on bending and load than paint color, and quick calculations show that the impact of temperature on expansion, on strength (Young’s modulus), etc. are extremely minor in a reasonable range of ambient temperatures. Like if one pole was 100F hotter than another pole, the height difference is less than 3/8″. Google “thermal coefficient steel”, “Youngs Modulus vs temperature”, and “Steel Brittle Transition temperature”.
THE ANSWER: Camouflage.
No. Really.
The tower is in an open area with no trees and an open view of Kirkwood’s Thimble Peak. As part of an environmental requirement to have a “Visual Resources Protection Plan” (frequently used in various environmental processes such as CEQA and the solution is often a grey or non-contrasting color for towers and equipment impacting views). The pole is painted an off yellow color that blends in well with the volcanic yellowish, brown rock at the peak and with snow during the winter. The Sierra Club opposed the development of Kirkwood and in particular, wanted to protect Thimble Peak. All of the other poles everywhere at Kirkwood are a dark green to blend in with the trees. As far as I have been able to tell, the pole has been this odd “rock matching” color from the beginning. It is a unique color and so is also consistent with trying to blend it. That is a plausible explanation and consistent with why only 1 in the entire chair lift (the one with no trees and nearest to Thimble Peak), only 1 such tower anywhere at Kirkwood, and only 1 such tower pretty much at any other ski area (specific to protecting Thimble Peak visual, not a common technique to manage thermal effects), and common sense that under such extreme outdoor conditions, nobody is relying on paint to manage safe mechanical designs.
The only exposed towers above Treeline are on the backside top of Sunrise #4 and it isn’t as a unique view as Thimble Peak and so the towers don’t have the same impact on an accessible view.
MORE WHY WHITE: More comments on my FB post, “RP” posted a link to blog “Lift Towers Impacted by Sun’s Heat?” https://www.snowjournal.com/discussion/4044/lift-towers-impacted-by-suns-heat which includes spot on and interesting comments from “Lift Guy” regarding Bretton Woods new Skyway Gondola. -40F overnight on a beautiful blue bird day can raise temperatures rapidly by 60F in my experience. And if rapid, then towers will have a significant variance of temperature on one side vs. the other side of a pole as Lift Guy calls ‘sun push’. That doesn’t matter at Kirkwood’s white #17 chair on Wagonwheel #10….there’s hundreds of feet between it and the next towers or the unloading station, so lot’s of compliance to overcome any tower bending. But at Bretton Woods detachable gondola, as it crosses two poles of a breakover tower with dozens of pulleys and a tight cable, the alignment difference is more critical and could easily be changed by inches as Lift Guy claims. Of course, no reason to not use white paint to control radiation on the other poles, so all poles are white on the Bretton Woods lift. But interestingly you can see that they strategically place radiation reflectors on the breakover towers to reduce the variations between the two poles (e.g., see photos of T16 here https://liftblog.com/bretton-woods-skyway-bretton-woods-nh/ )
So it is reasonable to think that the white paint has something to do with control of thermal effects on the mechanics. It is done elsewhere. It just doesn’t happen to be the case (I think) for Kirkwood because in this fixed chair situation on a simple support tower, there are not the alignment issues. If it were an issue, you’d expect more poles or all of the poles to be white. If thermal radiation mechanical effects were an issue, you’d expect to see similar features everywhere that sees rapid radiation effects of a rising sun, say Sunrise #4. Or you’d expect lifts put in around the same time to have the same feature, like Reut #11. And they don’t.
So the explanation that it is part of the Visual Resources Protection Plan (see previous comment) to protect view of Thimble Peak makes more sense in this specific case at Kirkwood.
Lift Blog 
The sheaves on this lift seem very similar to the Quicksilver lift at Boreal. I wonder why the state of California allows this lift to run and not Quicksilver.
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I was also curious as to find out what mechanical issues stopped Quicksilver from running. It was apparently due to aluminum sheaves and grip type. The majority of towers on Chair 10 seem to have been upgraded with Doppelmayr line gear with the exception of the white tower, depression sheaves and breakover. When I was at Kirkwood in 2010 for a powder day they only allowed Chair 10 to be loaded as a double. Our guide said it was due to the brushes on the motor needing replacement, as the motor wasn’t strong enough to pull a full line of chairs anymore. I think the motor has been replaced since then but not positive.
Side Note: I’ve heard the tower is painted white to prevent the metal from expanding too much from the heat of the sun. Which makes sense because its such a tall tower. But I’ve never seen this idea implemented in any other installation.
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A bunch of Park City’s towers were also painted different colors for a number of years. Off the top of my head Crescent Express comes to mind, all the lower elevation towers were painted black (like most of the mountain), and the higher elevation towers were painted white. It’s either the same idea (preventing expansion from the sun’s heat) or somebody ran out of paint.
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The Martis Camp Express at Northstar California runs north-south and its towers are split right down the middle. The north facing halves are black, the south facing parts white.
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Yes, taller towers are subject to solar deflection, hence the lighter color.
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Some newer Doppelmayr detachables (like the lovely “Kanc8 the great” [https://liftblog.com/kancamagus-8-loon-mountain-nh/]) have reflectors on the top tower for the same purpose.
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Thermal expansion of a 50′ pole would be less than 3/8″ even if the temperature difference was 100F. No doubt the towers could vary by feet without impacting anything with the compliance built into a cable system. Must be they ran out of paint and left it with primer or some other explanation.
Coefficient of thermal expansion of steel 0.00000645in/in/deg F to 0.00000720in/in/deg F; 50′ pole with 20F higher temperature would be 1/16″ higher.
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It’s not that the tower gets taller, it’s that towers with heavy sun on one side but not the other can have one side expand more than the other, bringing the tower out of alignment.
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It was Boreal’s decision to not run Quicksilver. There were issues with the Yan-10, they had that worked out with the state. The S-4 aluminum sheaves are in service a couple of areas in CA today.
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The breakover sheaves on this lift are lot like the ones Killington has on Superstar.
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The sheaves on the last tower and return terminal are what Yan used on the Squaw Valley Gondola.
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Why isn’t this lift a detachable?
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The terrain on the wall is very steep with no groomer down. A detachable may encourage too many people who have no business on terrain like that. I suspect that is a large reason it has never been updated. Along with the fact that money would be better spent on a detachable on other parts of the mountain such as chair 4.
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No Need, never busy expect for an hour on a powder day.
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I agree, keep chair 10 a triple, just like chair 23 at Mammoth. A high speed quad does attract the wrong crowed. Chair 6 already has too many downloads because people can’t read a map.
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It’s always amusing to watch “the wrong crowd” coming down from Chairs 6 and 10 right after lunch—and a few beers. “I’m gonna ski that thing, dang it!” Garage Sale City.
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WHY WHITE? Posting this on a Kirkwood FB group, a group member “JK” responded with the ‘real story’ — a more probable explanation than anything mechanical or thermal considerations. JK recalled a discussion with a lift maintenance person on this topic which seems to be consistent and make sense. Paint doesn’t change much in the delta T, there are a huge range of loading, convection, and radiant conditions that are far more significant on bending and load than paint color, and quick calculations show that the impact of temperature on expansion, on strength (Young’s modulus), etc. are extremely minor in a reasonable range of ambient temperatures. Like if one pole was 100F hotter than another pole, the height difference is less than 3/8″. Google “thermal coefficient steel”, “Youngs Modulus vs temperature”, and “Steel Brittle Transition temperature”.
THE ANSWER: Camouflage.
No. Really.
The tower is in an open area with no trees and an open view of Kirkwood’s Thimble Peak. As part of an environmental requirement to have a “Visual Resources Protection Plan” (frequently used in various environmental processes such as CEQA and the solution is often a grey or non-contrasting color for towers and equipment impacting views). The pole is painted an off yellow color that blends in well with the volcanic yellowish, brown rock at the peak and with snow during the winter. The Sierra Club opposed the development of Kirkwood and in particular, wanted to protect Thimble Peak. All of the other poles everywhere at Kirkwood are a dark green to blend in with the trees. As far as I have been able to tell, the pole has been this odd “rock matching” color from the beginning. It is a unique color and so is also consistent with trying to blend it. That is a plausible explanation and consistent with why only 1 in the entire chair lift (the one with no trees and nearest to Thimble Peak), only 1 such tower anywhere at Kirkwood, and only 1 such tower pretty much at any other ski area (specific to protecting Thimble Peak visual, not a common technique to manage thermal effects), and common sense that under such extreme outdoor conditions, nobody is relying on paint to manage safe mechanical designs.
The only exposed towers above Treeline are on the backside top of Sunrise #4 and it isn’t as a unique view as Thimble Peak and so the towers don’t have the same impact on an accessible view.
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MORE WHY WHITE: More comments on my FB post, “RP” posted a link to blog “Lift Towers Impacted by Sun’s Heat?” https://www.snowjournal.com/discussion/4044/lift-towers-impacted-by-suns-heat which includes spot on and interesting comments from “Lift Guy” regarding Bretton Woods new Skyway Gondola. -40F overnight on a beautiful blue bird day can raise temperatures rapidly by 60F in my experience. And if rapid, then towers will have a significant variance of temperature on one side vs. the other side of a pole as Lift Guy calls ‘sun push’. That doesn’t matter at Kirkwood’s white #17 chair on Wagonwheel #10….there’s hundreds of feet between it and the next towers or the unloading station, so lot’s of compliance to overcome any tower bending. But at Bretton Woods detachable gondola, as it crosses two poles of a breakover tower with dozens of pulleys and a tight cable, the alignment difference is more critical and could easily be changed by inches as Lift Guy claims. Of course, no reason to not use white paint to control radiation on the other poles, so all poles are white on the Bretton Woods lift. But interestingly you can see that they strategically place radiation reflectors on the breakover towers to reduce the variations between the two poles (e.g., see photos of T16 here https://liftblog.com/bretton-woods-skyway-bretton-woods-nh/ )
So it is reasonable to think that the white paint has something to do with control of thermal effects on the mechanics. It is done elsewhere. It just doesn’t happen to be the case (I think) for Kirkwood because in this fixed chair situation on a simple support tower, there are not the alignment issues. If it were an issue, you’d expect more poles or all of the poles to be white. If thermal radiation mechanical effects were an issue, you’d expect to see similar features everywhere that sees rapid radiation effects of a rising sun, say Sunrise #4. Or you’d expect lifts put in around the same time to have the same feature, like Reut #11. And they don’t.
So the explanation that it is part of the Visual Resources Protection Plan (see previous comment) to protect view of Thimble Peak makes more sense in this specific case at Kirkwood.
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This has to be one of the most interesting yan lifts I’ve ever seen.
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