Canada’s second largest resort without a high speed lift plans to build one soon. Castle Mountain, located in Southwestern Alberta, today announced it has reached an agreement in principle to acquire Sunshine Village’s outgoing Angel Express for an undisclosed sum. The 1988 Poma detachable quad will be retired this spring to make way for a new six person bubble chair at Sunshine.
“We are excited to be acquiring such a great lift from a reputable industry partner,” said Dean Parkinson, Castle Mountain Resort General Manager. “It is a great thing to be keeping this lift in Alberta and we appreciate Sunshine’s willingness to work with us on this purchase,” he continued. No location or timeline for reinstallation was announced. One logical scenario would see the quad replace the Sundance triple, Castle’s main out-of-base lift which opened in 1996. The used detachable could also replace the Huckleberry or Tamarack lifts. Perhaps more likely than either of those locations is an entirely new alignment. Castle’s latest master plan identified 10 different locations for possible future lifts as the resort grows. “When information is available on the reinstallation location and the expected timeline, we expect to share this in future press releases,” said Castle.
Once this project is complete, the largest remaining North American mountains without detachable lifts will be Red Mountain, British Columbia (4,200 acres); Discovery, Montana (2,200 acres); Bridger Bowl, Montana (2,000 acres); Lost Trail Powder Mountain, Idaho/Montana (1,800 acres); and Silverton Mountain, Colorado (1,800 acres).
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Why would they be buying such an Old lift when they’re must be newer generation ones out there that are being replaced with new models?
I get that they’re closer but still???
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So true a 36 year old HSQ iis usually just worn out at this point regardless of how well maintained.
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How do they get worn out? The cable is replaced regularly
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There are a lot more moving parts than just the haul rope. Additionally, steel fatigues over time.
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They would probably overhaul it.
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Doubt it would replace tamarack. I think it will either replace Sundance or T-Rex.
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The blog post on Castle Mountain’s master plan that is linked to in this one indicates that the plan had always been to consolidate the t-bar and Sundance into a single HSQ running on a new, less wind-exposed line. Sundance would then be shortened and repurposed to serve the lower mountain racing terrain just to the south of where it is today.
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It’s most definitely going to replace tamarack
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Are you kidding? Castle’s master plan calls for the retention of Tamarack and Huckleberry in their current forms. I especially do not see Castle replacing Tamarack with a HSQ, as it would suffer from frequent wind closures, more than the double already does. I could either see Sundance or Huckleberry getting replaced with the used quad as an out-of-base people mover.
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No it wouldn’t HSQ are very good in high winds. In fact the hsq from the late 80’s are some of the most reliable long lasting wind resistant lifts ever made.
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It’s replacing huck chair and that chair is meant to access the current cat ski area.
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Wouldn’t Whitewater qualify as the second largest resort without a detachable? I believe they are over 3200 acres in bounds terrain with the new Raven Chair terrain.
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Whitewater’s website quotes just over 1300 acres. Still one of the larger places without a detach, but not quite as big as Red and the Montana ski areas.
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Yup. I was mistakenly including hike-to terrain that is mostly not lift served. Given their master plan, they’ll be in that top 3 range pretty soon.
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Why hike, haven’t you heard about helicopters
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@Zac Secrist Some people can’t afford to go heli-skiing, so they have to hike.
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Whitewater has 1367 acres of skiing, the 3200 acres likely comes from the Controlled Recreational Boundary (CRA), which is where they can expand into and includes the other backside areas, White Queen and Qua Basin.
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Yet another HSQ reinstallation! I have been waiting for these to happen for years. Congratulations to Castle for this act of historic preservation.
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I’m sure it’s been well-maintained but still, oof.
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Maybe you should get your wallet out and help them buy the right one
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I don’t think anyone’s suggesting they buy a brand-new one; cost is real. But no one wants to see a preventable lift breakdown strain an independent resort, either.
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Well than stop complaining about them buying a used lift.
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Having skied Castle a fair bit, this upgrade will definitely be welcome, but I’m still puzzled why they went with Sunshine’s Angel chair. I would have thought a used fixed grip quad would have replaced Sundance. Huckleberry is also a painful slow and uncomfortable ride up. I have to imagine that Angel will end up becoming one of North America’s oldest detachable chairlifts, as I don’t see Castle as the kind of operation that has lots of cash to spare on replacing a lift like this 10+ years down the road.
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Forgot Montana Snowbowl which is now 2000 acres and intalled its first triple in 2023 only after being told the used Riblet double it had acquired could not make the haul.
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Well heck you should give them your resume. My goodness they won’t make through the season without you. Lmfao
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You must be new here huh
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Interesting choice for a used lift, I too am surprised that they opted to buy a 1988 chain driven Poma when countless newer detachables are on the market. I understand that transport cost is a major factor here, but I have identified multiple used detachables that should suffice for an area like Castle Mountain.
I-Lift/Timberline at Copper (1994 Doppelmayr DS series)
Skyliner at Bachelor (1989 Doppelmayr DS series)
Fitzsimmons at Whistler (1999 Doppelmayr DT series)
Big Red at Whistler (1997 Doppelmayr DT series)
Mount Hood Express at Meadows (1994 Poma TB-41)
The only concerns I see with Timberline and Mount Hood Express is that they might not have enough length and/or vertical to be of use at Castle. Skyliner, despite being tire driven, suffered mechanical breakdowns last year and was most likely either too old or mechanically totalled. However, I find it very surprising that Whistler could not find any buyers for Big Red or Fitz. I do realize that a control upgrade was necessary on Big Red and possibly Fitz as well but I am surprised that Castle hasn’t shown interest in either of these well maintained lifts. I understand that relocating Fitz and Big Red did not make sense for Whistler but it would most likely be cheaper than a new detachable, especially for a small area like Castle.
This brings the question as to the condition of Angel Express at Sunshine. I would hope that Castle has taken a look at the condition the lift is in before buying a 1988 chain driven Poma. Has Angel had any recent upgrades that we don’t know about?
This seems all too similar to Sasquatch Mountain’s attempt to install a used CLD-260 era detachable from Europe. I do not know the details but the detachable was never installed and the area ultimately opted for a new Leitner Poma quad. Seeing that Zephyr Express at Hunter (relocated 1987 Alpha Evolution model) has suffered from reliability issues, I doubt a 1988 Poma that’s essentially the same model would run any better.
In short, I don’t think Castle made the best move here.
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As someone who had a background in ski resorts and has skied and Angel thousands of times I will say Angel is very well maintained, probably comes with a lot of spare parts (SS keeps a good inventory for its lifts), and is not a bad choice. That said, it is tired and (said lovingly) a bit of a frankenlift from what I understand.
One positives is it has 100 diesel backup so can run when the power is down. Castle also has the old Divide Double from SS so I wonder if there is some perhaps friendship between the owners and they are getting Angel for not more than scrap value – just a guess but who knows.
Riding it a lot, it does have a lot of minor breakdowns and the mechanics are always fixing something. It also would be very high hours for its age as it runs 7 days a week, 8:30 – 4:00 or 4:30 usually from late November to early May on average.
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Green may have also come from Sunshine, so Angel would be the third used lift Castle buys from Sunshine. Castle seems to like buying used lifts from SS, so mabye a friendship?
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Skyliner, Big Red, and Fizsimmons were already off the table as they’ve been scrapped. Not sure about MHX. It’s possible we’ll sell I-lift, but I’ve not heard anything concrete. Angel seems a good fit as it’s relatively close and probably in decent shape. LPOA continues to support the TB grips and associated terminals (of all models) so there aren’t any worries there. If I were Castle, I’d invest in a tire contour and the current LPOA control system (if it doesn’t already have it).
Speaking of tires and chains, many of you use the terminology ‘chain-driven’. It’s probably just semantics, but that implies that the lift itself is driven by a chain when it definitely isn’t. The term used most often in our industry is ‘tire turnaround’ or ‘tire contour’, and when referring to chains we typically say ‘cadence chains’.
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MHX was scrapped as well. Parts were harvested/saved for the three other Poma quads of the same vintage that Meadows still operates.
It also had fairly high hours from what I heard from the mountain ops/maintenance folks. The Meadows ski season usually runs from thanksgiving through May, MHX was the resort’s main lift, and it was the primary lift for night skiing.
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Technically LP can build an Alpha-falcon or competition terminal if you want. I know they made a new challenger station for Red pine in Park City.
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They can build what again?
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Angel had its chains replaced by tires.
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First, I don’t think Castle was searching for a detachable in 2022, so most of the lift you mentioned don’t fit the timeframe.
Second, the Whistler HSQ’s required electrical upgrades which are expensive, correct me if I am wrong, but I believe that LPA offers more support towards older detachable models than Doppelmayr, so Castle may have wanted a Poma detach.
Third, Angel was very well maintained through its life and has had numerous upgrades from Leitner-Poma including, tires, underskins and I think some form of electric upgrades,
and, Castle also has very good relations with SSV and an older lift was also cheaper for them.
Castle is going to overhaul the lift, probably during the winter until next summer’s install, so it should be completely fine in the long run for many years to come.
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Looks like the 1988 American Poma Detach isn’t going extinct afterall
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I agree that the decision to purchase a 36 year old chair is puzzling in the least. I have only ridden Angel a couple times, but I ride Rainier Express at Crystal frequently and that chair experiences plenty of mechanical issues (admittedly it does operate in a very harsh environment).
I am guessing that Castle must have gotten this chair essentially for free from Sunshine or have some knowledge that the chair has been exceptionally well maintained and comes with many spare parts – cause otherwise this decision makes little sense. This isn’t a common model of chairlift and I wouldn’t be shocked to see its lifespan at Castle be pretty short as it nears the end of its operational lifespan. Hopefully they aren’t making a penny wise pound foolish decision by installing this chair instead of a newer model.
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My guess is they got it for a price which is basically the same as what the resort would get from scrapping it.
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Any rough idea what kind of dollars a resort would get for scraping a lift?
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Mechanicly its the same as the competition models. Rainier and Angel are totally different cases, Angel has recieved numeral upgrades and good maintenance.
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Hoping that Castle will use this lift to open new terrain on Haig, but suspect it will replace Sundance
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Using this to replace the T-bar and its alignment would probably be a wise deployment case. The Sundance chair isn’t gonna fall apart tomorrow, but it is a 40+ year old frankenriblet and I would imagine that spare parts are increasingly in short supply. Furthermore, it is arguably the primary lift of the hill and setting it aside for part time duty might be advised, in that a faster HSQ could become the prime mover. They just installed the Huckleberry in 2006 so I doubt it will be supplanted with this HSQ. Or maybe it will be deployed in a completely different way, who knows…
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My thought is that they should use either the new Lpa or Omega chairs for the reinstalation
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The current chairs are a solid model and should not need to be replaced, Castle will only change what needs to be changed.
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